Can you tell me about your early history and how
you found yourself in Newcastle in the late 70s?
Going to Newcastle was pretty un-thought through
and relatively accidental. I'd gone to Foundation in
Hertfordshire and for some reason I'd conceived of
the idea that I didn't want to go down to London. I'm
not quite sure what this is based on; probably being
18 and having strange ideas! I'd also got it into
my head the vague idea that Newcastle was
interesting. In retrospect I realise this was entirely
based on the ghosts of Richard Hamilton who
had left about 10 - 15 years before I arrived and had
taught at a completely different institution to the
Polytechnic I attended!
And in fact, I’d never been to Newcastle until I rocked
up with my portfolio and my bright red hair - it was
the 1977 summer of punk, or the morning or
whatever! But I was incredibly lucky actually, it was a
course that seemed to attract some misfits from the
students. There was a lot of local people, but also,
there was quite a lot of 'salon de refusé'; people who
had been unreasonably snotty from an early age for
no apparent reason!
And it was very interesting because the new media
department, you know, we're talking late 70s here;
there weren't many of them! Was run by, a whole
bunch of people who had been through the Royal
College a few years before and were really
bright, really hard core.
What was the department called, was it Third Area?
Yes, that’s what I’ve read.
Yes
Which makes it sound like some kind of alien
testing ground…
Well, that’s what it set itself up as. And that was
brilliant! So I went up there not sure what I was
wanting to do and I started out painting grids with a
great dedication. It seemed a reasonable thing to
do; you always knew what you were going to be
doing and didn't have to look around for subject
matter. And of course, I got rather dissatisfied with
this so I drifted into this Third Area. Roger Wilson was
the Head, there was David Dyer and Stuart Marshall.
All of whom were really interesting tutors,
ferociously intelligent. In retrospect they seemed
terribly grown up, but in fact, they were only 5 years
older than we were.
So, they'd set up their own fiefdom! And Helen
Chadwick would come up, Roberta Graham would
come up. Did John Stezaker ever come up?
Anyhow, all these people. Whilst had you been
anywhere else, you would probably have got only
one or two of them, or perhaps three of them, but
you wouldn't have got the entire thing.
About your experience at the Polytechnic, how
was the teaching structured?
Incredibly loosely! Some art schools were very
media specific at the time, but because of this third
area course, at Newcastle it was slightly more
disruptive and you could very easily fall through the
cracks, just as John Bewley and I did, with great
glee. I think we missed the entire second year
without anyone really noticing.
There was an extraordinary amount of freedom.
There was also a great deal of rivalry between
departments; if you walked away from the Sculpture
department for instance, some of the more bearded
members automatically dismissed you. No one was
looking out for you and nobody really cared. Which
was brilliant.
you found yourself in Newcastle in the late 70s?
Going to Newcastle was pretty un-thought through
and relatively accidental. I'd gone to Foundation in
Hertfordshire and for some reason I'd conceived of
the idea that I didn't want to go down to London. I'm
not quite sure what this is based on; probably being
18 and having strange ideas! I'd also got it into
my head the vague idea that Newcastle was
interesting. In retrospect I realise this was entirely
based on the ghosts of Richard Hamilton who
had left about 10 - 15 years before I arrived and had
taught at a completely different institution to the
Polytechnic I attended!
And in fact, I’d never been to Newcastle until I rocked
up with my portfolio and my bright red hair - it was
the 1977 summer of punk, or the morning or
whatever! But I was incredibly lucky actually, it was a
course that seemed to attract some misfits from the
students. There was a lot of local people, but also,
there was quite a lot of 'salon de refusé'; people who
had been unreasonably snotty from an early age for
no apparent reason!
And it was very interesting because the new media
department, you know, we're talking late 70s here;
there weren't many of them! Was run by, a whole
bunch of people who had been through the Royal
College a few years before and were really
bright, really hard core.
What was the department called, was it Third Area?
Yes, that’s what I’ve read.
Yes
Which makes it sound like some kind of alien
testing ground…
Well, that’s what it set itself up as. And that was
brilliant! So I went up there not sure what I was
wanting to do and I started out painting grids with a
great dedication. It seemed a reasonable thing to
do; you always knew what you were going to be
doing and didn't have to look around for subject
matter. And of course, I got rather dissatisfied with
this so I drifted into this Third Area. Roger Wilson was
the Head, there was David Dyer and Stuart Marshall.
All of whom were really interesting tutors,
ferociously intelligent. In retrospect they seemed
terribly grown up, but in fact, they were only 5 years
older than we were.
So, they'd set up their own fiefdom! And Helen
Chadwick would come up, Roberta Graham would
come up. Did John Stezaker ever come up?
Anyhow, all these people. Whilst had you been
anywhere else, you would probably have got only
one or two of them, or perhaps three of them, but
you wouldn't have got the entire thing.
About your experience at the Polytechnic, how
was the teaching structured?
Incredibly loosely! Some art schools were very
media specific at the time, but because of this third
area course, at Newcastle it was slightly more
disruptive and you could very easily fall through the
cracks, just as John Bewley and I did, with great
glee. I think we missed the entire second year
without anyone really noticing.
There was an extraordinary amount of freedom.
There was also a great deal of rivalry between
departments; if you walked away from the Sculpture
department for instance, some of the more bearded
members automatically dismissed you. No one was
looking out for you and nobody really cared. Which
was brilliant.